9 replies to this topic

[Andrew Burton]

Hi, Was playing as the German Graf Spea off the coast of South America taking on the British cruiser squardon consisting of Exeter, Ajax, and Achilles. Then wanted to split fire on Exter and Achilles. Then had to come to terms two triple turrets count as one quad turret, am I right or not? Then when the Brits got close enough they got one of my main 11' turrets, and to my fear realized my fire deminished to 1/3 and not 50% of my orgianl firepower. If Royal Navey fan yeah, but I am a German player and wanting some help please.thank youAndrew Burton

[Lonnie Gill]

G' Day Andrew,Two triple turrets have a total of 6 x 11" guns, which result in using three D12s for a gunnery attack. This is different from a quad turret, which would be limited to two D12s. Loss of a triple turrret, however, is painful as the number of D12s for the guns in a single triple turret are rounded down to one D12. This reflects a fundamental design trade off all naval designers faced in which the weight savings of triple turrets was countered by the increased vulnerability to damage. This was certainly a concern for USN designers. who finally decided that the weight savings and reduced lengths of hulls that needed to be armored were worth the risk. That is more of an issue when a ship has only two triple turrets. Additionally, it was generally agreed that triple turrets did not provide much advantage over twin turrets in the fall of shot. When firing salvos of six or nine shells into the impact area, this difference was minor as there was enough cumulative dispersion in the impact zone. But, it became more pronounced when only a single turret was employed. Hence, the rule to round down for a single turret.LONNIE

[Chris Lane]

Hang on, I'm confused now.

So the Graf Spee, having 6x 11" guns has three dice even though each turret has 3x 11".

I have been playing that if a turret has 3 guns you round it down to 2 and if it has 1 gun you round it up to 2.

How would this work on the Littorio class were there are 9x15inch guns. Would this mean that you would get 8 dice?

[Cpt M]

Hang on, I'm confused now.

So the Graf Spee, having 6x 11" guns has three dice even though each turret has 3x 11".

I have been playing that if a turret has 3 guns you round it down to 2 and if it has 1 gun you round it up to 2.

How would this work on the Littorio class were there are 9x15inch guns. Would this mean that you would get 8 dice?

Whoa! Clarification is in order....

You count the total nummber of guns firing (not turret by turret) and divide by 2 to get the number of D12s to roll. In cases of an odd number, you round up if the guns are single mounts and round down if triple mounts . So the Graf Spee (with 2x3 11") would have 6 guns in total firing which results in rolling 3 D12s (6 divided by 2 equals 3). If she loses a turret, her total fire is now 3 11" which results in rolling 1 D12 (6 divided by 2 equals 1.5, rounded down to 1 for a triple mount).

Now for the Littorio (or any ship with 3 triple turrets), the total number of guns firing would be 9 which results in 4 D12s (9 divided by 2 equals 4.5, rounded down to 4 for triples mount). If a turret is lost, the resulting 6 guns would roll 3 D12s, and if another is lost (bad news, that) then the remaining 3 guns would get 1 D12.

The reason for this, is that triple turrets tended to be less effective (due to more cramped design, ammo supply restrictions, fire dispersion and other issues) compared to twin turrets.

[Chris Lane]

ahh brilliant! That makes a lot more sense now! Thanks Coastal!

[Kenneth D. Hall]

(snip) This reflects a fundamental design trade off all naval designers faced in which the weight savings of triple turrets was countered by the increased vulnerability to damage. This was certainly a concern for USN designers. who finally decided that the weight savings and reduced lengths of hulls that needed to be armored were worth the risk. That is more of an issue when a ship has only two triple turrets. Additionally, it was generally agreed that triple turrets did not provide much advantage over twin turrets in the fall of shot. When firing salvos of six or nine shells into the impact area, this difference was minor as there was enough cumulative dispersion in the impact zone. But, it became more pronounced when only a single turret was employed. Hence, the rule to round down for a single turret.LONNIE

This is a clear and concise explanation. I've had players kvetch about this rule in the past, and this will help.

[Aman]

personally, I've gone with the optional suggestion to roll d20 for shooting and made it by barrel, thus eliminating math. So if you've a DD with 5 barrels, you get 5 dice in any configuration.

[pyruse]

Or you could roll d12s for each pair of guns, and a d20 for any odd gun. That cuts down the number of dice required

[Cpt M]

_{While such 'house rules' may be appealing, they do fundamentally change the way fire is adjudicated (and introduce some non-historical effects). Before I'd use these, I'd reread the earlier postings in this thread regarding why triple turrets (and single guns) are handled the way they are within the game.}