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8" & larger fire at DDs


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#1 W. Clark

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 07:20 PM

My understanding of 8" and larger guns firing at DDs is that AP rounds often did not go off because of the DD's lack armor. The large shell passing through and leaving a large hole(s) but not exploding. On the other hand HE shells would go off (provided their were not duds) and wreck all kinds of damage against an unarmored DD that they would not cause to an armored target because they did not penetrate the armor.

So, does the equivalent hit represent AP or HE damage against DDs; or is it all lumped together?

My reason for askling the above is that if the hits represent AP fire shouldn't they be increased when firing HE and if they represent HE fire shouldn't they be decreased when firing AP?

Another point is the limited amount of ammo the Japanese carried (about 120 rounds per gun). Take a 14" firing at 1.5 rounds per minute that equates to 80 minutes worth of ammo but only 30 minutes for an 8" (at 4 rounds per minute). It would seem to me that any engagement lasting 30 minutes or longer would not leave much ammo left over for a bombardment mission.

I'm curious to see if my thinking is valid in part or whole and what you would recommend as far as ammo limitations for bombardment missions that are engaged, but not aborted. In other words can I run them out of ammo and send those ammo depleted sons of Nippon home without them shelling my air base even if I cannot sink em?

#2 Cpt M

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 09:12 PM

My understanding of 8" and larger guns firing at DDs is that AP rounds often did not go off because of the DD's lack armor. The large shell passing through and leaving a large hole(s) but not exploding. On the other hand HE shells would go off (provided their were not duds) and wreck all kinds of damage against an unarmored DD that they would not cause to an armored target because they did not penetrate the armor.

So, does the equivalent hit represent AP or HE damage against DDs; or is it all lumped together?

My reason for askling the above is that if the hits represent AP fire shouldn't they be increased when firing HE and if they represent HE fire shouldn't they be decreased when firing AP?

The rules do not specify whether fire is AP or HE since that is below the level of command represented. The assumption is that the subordinate gunnery officer involved would use the correct shell for the given target (that is his job, afterall). So the equivalent hit table assumes the 'right shell for the right target'. Any modifications to this would need to be scenario specific (and outside the general rules).

Another point is the limited amount of ammo the Japanese carried (about 120 rounds per gun). Take a 14" firing at 1.5 rounds per minute that equates to 80 minutes worth of ammo but only 30 minutes for an 8" (at 4 rounds per minute). It would seem to me that any engagement lasting 30 minutes or longer would not leave much ammo left over for a bombardment mission.

I'm curious to see if my thinking is valid in part or whole and what you would recommend as far as ammo limitations for bombardment missions that are engaged, but not aborted. In other words can I run them out of ammo and send those ammo depleted sons of Nippon home without them shelling my air base even if I cannot sink em?

Early on, there was some discussion of including ammo limitation rules. But, since most gamers have an almost manic adversion to such rules and, for most games, they would not really come into play, the decision was made to apply ammo limitations only to rapid fire. Also, the 'book' rate of fire is always much higher than the actually rate of fire over the course of a battle due to the many breaks in firing. So while a ship may fire off at 4 rounds a minute for 2-3 minutes, that could well be followed by 10 minutes of check fire. Even in the most active of the Solomons battles, rarely would any of the ships ever come close to runnning out of their basic ammo load.

The short answer to your second part is no. It is assumed that the IJN would hold enough of their special bombardment rounds for the bombardment mission to continue.

#3 W. Clark

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 04:12 AM

Thanks Coastal. I can not seem to help myself. I keep trying to find a way to run the IJN ragged with DDs without risking my heavies. I guess I'm just going to have to take my medicine.




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