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HE rounds at infantry inside the building


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#1 Robak

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 02:22 PM

Hey:)

I've got question. Last time when we were playing we've faced the problem how to solve this situation. In my opinion it makes no sense to use rules from the book because it's not really possible to position stands inside the building that you fire at. Whats more how the round could deviate 3 meter farther inside the building;) Do you have some walk around like for example all stands inside building are partially hit etc.?



#2 Bob Benge

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 08:04 PM

Sorry for the delay in response Robak.

 

I am assuming you are referring to Direct Fire Deviation of HE rounds... So to start...

 

I understand that with miniature buildings it is hard to impossible to get the miniatures in the building.  There are ways to handle this. You can use an area on a sheet of paper (square drawn on the paper) and place the minis on this that are in the building. You can also lean the minis against the building. There are probably other ways to handle this as well...

 

As to stands taking damage in the building, well, per the rules, a stand is given hard cover unless the stand is in a Soft Structure which would give the stand(s) Soft Cover. This info is located in Chapter 15 Structures.

 

As to Direct Fire Deviation of HE rounds... If the round does deviate and still hits the same building then some one is lucky, but it can happen. The round probably just hits in a different location and the stands still gets the cover modifier. It may suck but it does happen.

 

I recommend you review the Structures Chapter as it pertains to the occupants.

 

Hope this helps! :)


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#3 healey36

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 06:57 AM

Back in the day our developed solution to the conundrum of tracking infantry/heavy weapons teams moving/fighting through buildings was to presume most or all were in a ruined condition (i.e. walls and/or roof partially vacated). We made numerous city/town/industrial terrain modules as here: 

 

Town ruins

 

Ruined factory mod 1a

 

Ruined Factory Mod 1c
 
Ruined farm

 

 

A ruined building, as demonstrated through numerous historical urban battles, provides a high degree of cover from direct fire and, if upper floors are intact, from light plunging fire as well. You still get all of the LOS effects, but you can drop your infantry stands inside. If you introduce the availability of arty then that's another kettle of fish, although there could be house-rules or an adaptation of fortification/entrenchment rules to address.

 

We found this to be an effective way to simulate house-to-house fighting while removing the bookkeeping required for static, enclosed building models.

 

Healey



#4 Peter M. Skaar

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Posted 06 May 2017 - 02:32 PM

Very nice buildings there Healy!  Are any of those commercially available or did you make them yourself?

Pete



#5 healey36

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Posted 06 May 2017 - 03:38 PM

Homemade, Pete, probably twenty-five years ago. We recently dug them out of storage and plan to use them with MP.

#6 Peter M. Skaar

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Posted 17 June 2017 - 02:04 PM

Healy, the buildings do look very nice.  My solution is to use off board holding boxes for the actual troops inside the buildings.  I am still working on this however.

 

Pete



#7 healey36

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Posted 19 June 2017 - 06:15 PM

Pete, I recall attempting something similar. Years ago we tried developing a scaled-up variation using bits and designer notes from the old SPI Sniper/Patrol boardgames, even tracking individuals/squads moving between floors/rooms. An infantry battalion pushing into a well-defended small town and it got really hairy...folks got frustrated with so much action occurring off the table. Any serious effort in an urban setting and you'd have the bulk of the infantry maneuvering on sheets of paper on a separate table. Using ruined buildings with floors collapsed to a single level simplified things, maintained the table visuals and didn't sacrifice most of the direct-fire terrain benefits provided by buildings (if anything, history has shown rubbled buildings provide as good or better cover).

 

Have you ever tried any of Scott Washburn's "Paper Terrain"? All of the buildings have an "intact" outer shell which when removed reveals a ruined state for the structure. It opens up the possibility of moving into an intact space, then gradually reducing it as folks push through.  I've never used any of his 1/285-1/300 scale models but have a number of his 15/18mm buildings we use when we want to give the Corsican a good thrashing. They are very neat and fun to assemble. See here:

 

http://www.paperterrain.com/

 

The small stuff might be a bit fiddly, but worthy of consideration.

 

Healey






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