9 replies to this topic

[FarEasternWanderer]

Page 2.3  TWO PLAYER ACTIVATION TABLE EXAMPLE

I think the first table should have 5 black boxes? Also each seems to be missing a label (Russian/German player)?

 

Page 2.4 WHAT ARE UNITS?

I don’t think this answers its own question.  

 

Page 3.1 SQUAD “This is probably the most basic unit within an army and would contain 6 to 12 soldiers.”

This meaning of ‘unit’ is the same as 1 stand? 

And on the activation table are we marking a black square for each stand?

 

 

Cheers!

 

[Smokey_Smith]

In Mein Panzer, with some exceptions, a "unit" is a platoon, troop, or battery. A stand represents a section/squad, gun, officer, or vehicle. Each nations military has its own way of organizing its forces, but generally a platoon is 1 officer, and 30-40 men, a battery is 1-3 guns, and a troop is 2-4 armoured vehicles or 3 squads of combat engineers. In game terms, a platoon would have 1 officer stand, 3 - 4 squad stands, 1 - 3 weapon stands (mortars, machine guns, anti tank weapons). A battery would have 1 - 3 gun stands. A troop would have 2 - 4 vehicle stands, or 3 squad stands of combat engineers.

 

When you activate a "unit" you activate the entire unit. So if you activated a platoon, you would activate the officer stand, all the squad stands, and all the weapon stands at the same time.

 

To understand how army formations work in Mein Panzer, you do require a basic knowledge of real world military organization. The idea of a unit will make a lot more sense when you understand how everything fits from section/squad - platoon/battery/troop - company - battalion/squadron - regiment - brigade - division - corps - army - army group.

 

This video should help explain things a little better.

[FarEasternWanderer]

Yes, thanks Smokey, but my point was rather a rules query:  "SQUAD “This is probably the most basic unit within an army and would contain 6 to 12 soldiers.”  <--- this is not how the term 'unit' is used later in the book. So for new people like myself, that threw me.

[FarEasternWanderer]

In addition to this:

 

 

Page 2.3  TWO PLAYER ACTIVATION TABLE EXAMPLE

I think the first table should have 5 black boxes? Also each seems to be missing a label (Russian/German player)?

 

This:

 

Page 7.2   Table 7.1 FIRER INFANTRY WITH CASUALTIES appears missing from the table along with its modifier? 

 

Page 2.3  TWO PLAYER ACTIVATION TABLE EXAMPLE

I think the first table should have 5 black boxes? Also each seems to be missing a label (Russian/German player)?

 

 

I am beginning to wonder if my edition is old. Says 1998. 2.1B

[Kenny Noe]

The initial version of Mein Panzer was printed in 1998.  It was called Main Panzer WWII Edition.   It was saddle stitched and included a small WWII Databook.

 

In 2003 Mein Panzer was significantly updated (particularly wrt infantry and it's survivability in the game).  This was re-branded Mein Panzer Core Rules (MPC) and the databook was removed and greatly expanded to it's own book.   Other war databooks followed (WWI, Spanish Civil War, etc).

 

In 2023, MPC was updated again but primary with how-to and clearer examples of play.  See the forum post (https://rb.gy/l6w44h)

 

As for the questions:

 

TWO PLAYER ACTIVATION TABLE EXAMPLE

you are correct and will note that for the next update  Thanks

 

 

FIRER INFANTRY WITH CASUALTIES

Will have to investigate this more.  (I don't use infantry too often in my games.  <grin>)

[Bob Benge]

Hi FarEasternWanderer,

 

In reference to your questions, what version of the book you are looking at since some of the questions don't seem to jive to the current version of the rules, which is 2.1C (but will be annoted as 2.1B depending upon when it was bought and.or downloaded)?

 

Note that I found a little oops on the credits page that the version, as current on the latest book, shows 2.1B and should have the revision as 2.1C after the latest updates made earlier this year. 

 

Anyway, here is some info on your questions using the current version of MP Core Rules...

 

Page 2.3  TWO PLAYER ACTIVATION TABLE EXAMPLE

• I think the first table should have 5 black boxes? Also each seems to be missing a label (Russian/German player)?
  • The current version of the rules page 2.3 needs to updated to match your recommendation (which I just did as I was responding to the question so I wouldn't forget  )

 

Page 2.4 WHAT ARE UNITS?

• I don’t think this answers its own question.
  • As referenced in the latest version of the rules: "Individual models are usually organized into platoons. Each nationality has typical organization tables for the period if you choose to use  them. We recommend this method but it is up to you. If you choose not to use actual TO&E, you should organize your models into platoons of 3-5 models.", IMHO this does define the basics of the future use of the term "unit" as referenced for future mention in the chapter

 

Page 3.1 SQUAD “This is probably the most basic unit within an army and would contain 6 to 12 soldiers.”

• This meaning of ‘unit’ is the same as 1 stand?
  • No it is not. Unit is a general term used in reference to the definition: "an individual thing or person regarded as single and complete but which can also form an individual component of a larger or more complex whole." as used in the chapter. The Squad is a unit that is part of a Platoon. A Platoon is a unit that is part of Company, etc. Looking at the Platton definition in Chapter 2, page 3.1 1st column, "PLATOON - This is the primary unit used in MeinPanzer. It typically contains 3-4 Infantry Squads, 3-5 tanks, or up to four mortars. Towed guns are  sometimes organized into Platoons as well. In the game, think of this level when you see the word “Unit.” When building your army, you will organize your miniatures into Platoons,  based upon the organization of the nation you are playing."
• And on the activation table are we marking a black square for each stand?
  • No, as mentioned by Smokey_Smith, the black squares are units being activated. So depending upon the make up of the national forces, it could be platoons (made up of a number of squads or tanks, batteries (for artilleryor anti-tank guns, etc.) Typical unit break-downs are shown in the different databooks TO&E sections.

 

 

Page 7.2   Table 7.1 FIRER INFANTRY WITH CASUALTIES

• Appears missing from the table along with its modifier?
  • Not seeing this in the current version of the book. All references in the chapter are correct. There is no such table in the current version or reference to this.

Hope this helps some.

 

Note that the changes mentiooned here in blue have been made and updated to the MPCore online book and available for download.

[FarEasternWanderer]

All good except 2.1C,  which I just downloaded, still has this on page 7.2:

 

"FIRER INFANTRY WITH CASUALTIES

In an infantry stand is firing at a non- infantry stand, it uses the method of Direct Fire as other stands. If the infantry stand has sustained casualties, this modifier applies."

 

 

PROBLEM: It does not say what "this modifier" is, and neither does this modifier appear on the neighbouring table, 7.1, which is where I think it should be.

 

 

Incidentally, in that paragraph quoted above, the first word should be "If", not "In".  

[Bob Benge]

Ah, I see says the blind man...

 

Had a talk with Kenny on this one. I think we may have written this modifier out with the update to infantry that was done a long while back. We are going to chat it over with the entire staff during Fall-In in a couple of weeks to ensure that we make the appropriate decision, which is possibly removing the paragraph from the rules or adding an appropriate modifier. For now, ignore the paragraph until we come to a decision.

 

More to come on this after Fall-In.

[FarEasternWanderer]

Got another question. Can't see where it says about Infantry move distances. The generic tables list S and B which I surmise is Standard and Bonus but not sure how that is used, or why B is always 1 more than S.

 

Cheers

[Bob Benge]

You are correct S is standard move distance and B is bonus move distance (see Chapter 9 - Equipment Table Help, page 9.1, Small Arm Table section (third column), Move sub-section). These are used just they are as vehicles. Use the S value when using the standard action to move and the B value if/when using the bonus move. This was done to keep things simple, rather than using 2 1/2 for each. Also it was assumed that if the infantry was using their bonus move then they were hastily moving, not necessarily walking. Bottom line, it was a playability decision.