5 replies to this topic

[Dan Lewis]

I was reading about the Supersherman on Wikipedia. They were of course discussing the use of the AMX 75mm gun and how it was adapted to the Sherman. But in the middle of all there is a single sentence that said "This same gun was also fitted to a number of M10 tank destroyers.^[8]"

 

^{The footnote reads 8.}Givati, p.106

 

Givati Refers to: Givati, Moshe - The Armor Craftsmen - The History of the 7100 Restoration and Maintenance Center, MoD 1998 ( ISBN 965-05-0902-X, 1998)

 

If this information is valid, would you be able to provide specs for the M10 with the AMX 75mm gun? 

[Dan Lewis]

Here's another citation, this time from Wikipedia article on M10. 

 

• Israeli M10s: Israeli Ordnance Corps converted tanks, using 75mm guns received from France. This gun was fitted to a number of M10s (originally Achilles tank destroyers), that were renamed as M-50 Achilles tank destroyers.

[Kenny Noe]

A great find...  I've contacted a friend who writes books on the IDF in particular vehicles for confirmation and any additional bits.  Check his books out at https://www.sabingamartin.com/

 

I can do this after I return from Historicon.  Leaving in a couple hours.

 

Thanks

[Kenny Noe]

Dan,

 

I didn't forget! <grin>

 

 

the note on the Achilles (102) is a reminder that the .50 cal AA MG wasn't always mounted.  This applies to the M10 SA50.  (I'm too lazy to reload the stat image, sorry)

 

I included the M10 Wolverine and 17pdr Achilles for "what if" scenarios.  These have been run thru the algorithm for modern stats, so don't rush to the WWII Databook and start a "holy war" on the stat differences.  LOL

 

I'll be adding to the book proper when I get more errata to update.

 

Robert Manasherob told me he will have a book on this specific vehicle coming out, but declined to a time line.  So more info coming.  In the mean time I found this on War Thunder forums.  Good history on the vehicle and it's conversion.  The comments are fun to read as well.   https://forum.warthu...olverine/104433

 

Thanks

[Kenny Noe]

So when investigating the M10 SA50 TD, I went down a rabbit hole and really investigated the French CN 75-50 cannon and the various ammunitions it fired.  This took me even deeper to re-check my initial stats for the other AFVs that carried the same gun.

 

I found evidence that while the French did developed  an APDS and a HEAT round to enhance the initial APBC and the APCBC rounds they never were accepted into service (ie left the prototype/experimental stage).  Singapore licensed the APCBC round and did develop an APERS and APFSDS round for the AMX-13 they purchased from Israel in the 1980s.

 

Really interesting stuff to follow a weapon system around the world like CN 75-50 cannon.

 

This to say that I went back and found that some of the AFVs stats didn't quite match up as they should have.

 

Below are the amended stats for immediate use.  I'll post the undated thread when the databook itself has been updated.

 

Thanks

 

[Dan Lewis]

Thanks so much Kenny. I hope that you enjoyed Historicon.