5 replies to this topic

[Bill Farley]

Just started to explore the submarine operatiopns. One of my sub commanders was turning his sub on a dime. When I said he could not do that his reply was the rules do not specifiy turning limits for subs. My take on the rules is a sub manuvers under water just like it was on the surface. With plotting and 500 yard advace etc. Am I right I need clarification because my friend can be a rules lawyer.Thank you for any helpBill F.

[Cpt M]

Just started to explore the submarine operatiopns. One of my sub commanders was turning his sub on a dime. When I said he could not do that his reply was the rules do not specifiy turning limits for subs. My take on the rules is a sub manuvers under water just like it was on the surface. With plotting and 500 yard advace etc. Am I right I need clarification because my friend can be a rules lawyer.

Well, you're both right. When altering course at speeds below 10 knots, you do not need to advance 500 yds (see 1.2.3 Altering Course, Answering the Helm ). Since the top submerged speed of all subs (except for the very rare German Type XXI) falls below 10 kts, they would not need to advance 500 yds before changing course even at full speed. The same rule would apply to surface movement; if the sub is making 10 kts or move, then it would need to advance 500 yds before changing course. If it stays below 10 kts, then it would not need to advance. You still need to use the Turning Gauge for both submerged and surfaced movement, however.

[Bill Farley]

Thank you for the quick reply it will help.Bill

[Lonnie Gill]

Bill,I would also add that Amendment 1, available for download elsewhere on the ODGW website, provides for an advance of 100 yds/2 kts of movement for vessels moving less than 10 kts. One thing that is not often realized is how long it takes a slowly moving submerged submarine to make a change of course. Use of the reduced advance along with the Ship Turn Indicator will reflect this.Your friend is right on another aspect, however. Submarines (especially the German Type VII) generally had a smaller turning radius than surface ships such as escorts. This is not an issue unless the sub and an escort are in close proximity. Then, the smaller turning radius is reflected by having a submarine add + 1 to its CDR in collision situations.Cheers,LONNIE

[r6751]

I submit for your rules lawyer friend that real life units below the surface often had currents while surfaced ships had current and wind to deal with when turning. All objections in games can be handled by die rolls. In fact, single case 'incidents' that are not covered precisely by rules can be resolved with a die roll that deals with the issue. A set of supplementary rule addons for future games can be suggested before game start and implemented or not.

[healey36]

 

Just getting around to looking at the submarine rules and play in detail, specifically as they apply to WWI operations. Should be interesting. Am I right in presuming that the sub rules for FAI use those of GQ3?