9 replies to this topic

[jbru362]

Is a ship's flank speed the highest speed listed or the current highest speed if speed is reduced from damage?

 

I would assume it's the current highest speed because in the few rules where it is mentioned (1.2.1, coal fired ships cannot maintain flank speed indefinitely, 4.2.2 moving at flank speed once the enemy is contacted, 4.7.3 POL consumption) it seems that going as fast as is currently possible would be what is in mind.

 

For a second question, the Now Hear This box on page 1-2 mentions how running at flank speed would make life on the ship difficult, to include making using a rangefinder more difficult. This would imply that there should be penalties to gunnery and probably the inability to launch torpedoes or aircraft if a ship is running at flank speed. But I can't find any rules to that affect.

 

So if there isn't such a rule, I'd like to add one for my games and I wondered if anyone had any thoughts on that. And if flank speed does cause penalties, what is flank speed in that case? It seems from reading the Now Hear This, that in this case, flank speed is not "the fastest the ship can go right now" but is instead "a speed faster than it's hull speed". I assume that wouldn't change with damage?

 

Thanks,

Jeremy 

[W. Clark]

​In the case of ships powered by coal, stoker exhaustion is a real concern. As far vibration and other factors from high-speed affecting gunnery, I would think that would depend on the ship, just as actual turning radius varies from ship class and sometimes from ship to ship. But as far as I can tell the RAW does not have a gunnery modifier for ship's going all out.

 

WMC

[healey36]

There is a limit on the length of time one can proceed at flank speed, correct? Also, is flank speed the range as specified by the box furthest to the left on the log, or is it literally the top speed? In other words, if the top speed is listed as 24 knots, but one proceeds at 23 knots (well within the range of the top box), is that considered flank speed, or is it just 24 knots?

[W. Clark]

​If you are coal powered and moving faster than the light grey box you are limited to how many turns you can at that speed before slowing to allow your stokers to rest. 

 

7.2.1 Ship Speed A ship’s current maximum speed capacity is indicated in the leftmost Hull Box not marked off on her Ship Log. You may move a ship at speeds up to her maximum; she may never exceed her current maximum speed. • Coal Fired These ships cannot steam at flank speed for more than 20 Game Turns due to stoker fatigue. They must then reduce speed to that listed in the gray shaded Hull Box on their Ship Logs (unless previously marked off) for 10 Game Turns to rest their stokers. Oil fired ships and diesel powered submarines do not have this limitation. • Coal fired ships have a white “C” in a black square in the lower right corner of their Ship Logs. • Flank speed can be resumed after stokers are rested.

 

It appears that any speed beyond the speed listed in the shaded grey box on the ship log is considered flank speed for coal powered ships.

 

WMC

[jbru362]

Yep. That's pretty clear. I just didn't read it closely enough. Thanks for pointing that out

Probably still some nuances with what to do if the ship is steaming at it's *current* maximum speed after taking damage, but likely not worth worrying about. As for a house rule penalty for combat penalties at flank speed, probably something like:

 

- No torpedo attacks

- Gunnery: shift up 2 rows, but table entry better than a 1 is treated as a 1

 

would probably work. I'd probably impose the penalty for any speeds *above* the second hull box

 

​If you are coal powered and moving faster than the light grey box you are limited to how many turns you can at that speed before slowing to allow your stokers to rest. 

 

7.2.1 Ship Speed A ship’s current maximum speed capacity is indicated in the leftmost Hull Box not marked off on her Ship Log. You may move a ship at speeds up to her maximum; she may never exceed her current maximum speed. • Coal Fired These ships cannot steam at flank speed for more than 20 Game Turns due to stoker fatigue. They must then reduce speed to that listed in the gray shaded Hull Box on their Ship Logs (unless previously marked off) for 10 Game Turns to rest their stokers. Oil fired ships and diesel powered submarines do not have this limitation. • Coal fired ships have a white “C” in a black square in the lower right corner of their Ship Logs. • Flank speed can be resumed after stokers are rested.

 

It appears that any speed beyond the speed listed in the shaded grey box on the ship log is considered flank speed for coal powered ships.

 

[W. Clark]

My advice (for what that is worth) is to keep house rules for small scenarios as they are just one thing more to do when the number of ships involved start to slow the game. And as I said before, vibration bad enough to affect your gunnery that it requires a one or two upshifts to model is not an across-the-board situation. Some ship classes and sometimes individual ships within a class warrant such a penalty. But there will at least indicators if not real evidence in the historical record that the ship(s) require this treatment. 

 

WMC

[jbru362]

Interesting. So, would ships that could handle flank speed without disrupting gunnery, frequently run at flank speed during a battle? My players have a tendency to go as fast as possible and I honestly have no idea if that is realistic or not. Maybe it's just a lack of a good understanding of naval tactics on their (and my) part. I'm pretty new to naval gaming, but it's always intrigued me. I just lack the knowledge of *how* things were done compared to what I know about land combat

 

My advice (for what that is worth) is to keep house rules for small scenarios as they are just one thing more to do when the number of ships involved start to slow the game. And as I said before, vibration bad enough to affect your gunnery that it requires a one or two upshifts to model is not an across-the-board situation. Some ship classes and sometimes individual ships within a class warrant such a penalty. But there will at least indicators if not real evidence in the historical record that the ship(s) require this treatment. 

 

WMC

[W. Clark]

There are many ship classes that will be affected, but not all. The ships I expect to be affected the most are ships capable of speeds exceeding 35 knots. My understanding of the French Contre-Torpilleus was that they all had to slow down to the mid to low 30s or their gunnery suffered. But that is an expectation not completely based in research and it may not work as a general rule.

 

WMC

[jbru362]

Thanks for the information. I need to do a lot of reading, clearly

[healey36]

It appears that any speed beyond the speed listed in the shaded grey box on the ship log is considered flank speed for coal powered ships.

 

 

Thanks for that clarification. It makes sense, just hadn't thought about it from that angle.