1 reply to this topic

[Dan Lewis]

In my most recent Arab Israeli battle, the Egyptians had T34-85 and SU100 and one of the players pointed out that these tanks can't go hull down because they didn't have enough gun depression. I checked and the gun depression on the T34 is 5 degrees and on other tanks a typical gun depression might be 10 degrees. I used AI to calculate that if the t34 was at a height of 50 meters and using 5 Degree gun depression the dead ground started at 517 meters or less. If it was at a height of 100 meters the dead ground space started at around 1100 meters. I guess that assumes the T34 is level. If it is angled upwards like a reverse slope, likely can't hit anything from hull down. 

 

Just wonder if you guys have run into this before. 

 

I did find a very good discussion on TMP on the subject "Tank main gun depression and hull-down". Very good information. One of the writers was ex military and commanded a Leopord tank in Germany. Very interesting his input. 

 

One thing that this discussion reinforced was that it was difficult to find hull down and greatly depended upon the experience of the crew. This supports the Mein Panzer Rule system that requires one action to find hull down and must pass a troop quality test. That in my experience is very unsual requirement in wargame rules but I think it's essentially spot on from what I've read so far. 

 

 

 

http://theminiatures...sg.mv?id=200026

 

[Kenny Noe]

The whole "Where is the Dead Zone from a Hill Top" Holy War has been fought within the MP Playtest group several times over the years.  We've never come up with an "easy to implement" rule on the subject and therefore leave that particular situation to the Gamers.

 

If you PM Bob, he may give a more reasonable answer....  but I have none.  In my games, AFVs usually die before they get close enough to make this an issue.  While GM'ing a game and players choose this Holy War, I usually have a dice roll off and keep the game moving.  My 0.02¢

 

I agree that finding a "Hull Down" in open terrain is difficult. The commander and especially the driver have to find that needle in a haystack that affords the protection.  It's not a gimme.

 

Read  the chapter Advance Game Mechanics, Hull Down section p 5.6 for explanation and detail.  The section also explains getting a hull down on a hill's reverse slope.  In my games I allow this for western AFVs but not for eastern AFVs due to the gun tube depression issue.  But that's in my games.