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#1 acctingman69

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Posted 25 July 2019 - 02:49 PM

Is a "unit" in this game a squad (3 to 5 men on a stand) or is the unit the entire platoon?

#2 Mark 1

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Posted 29 July 2019 - 03:44 PM

I am not a part of the ODGW team. But I am a user of the Mein Panzer rules, and have been a user since the MP to MP2 (beta) process.  My input here is not "official" word -- just the interpretation of one who is familiar with the rules.

 

In terms of the vocabulary used in the rules:

 

Unit:  See 2.3 of the Core Rules for "What are Units"

The term "unit" as used in the rules is usually a platoon.  It is the stands that you may be thinking of when you use the term "unit", but in the rules there are specific meanings. A base with some number of figures, or a tank model, or a gun and crew, are a "stand". A "unit" is used as a specific term for a platoon-sized group of stands -- the unit is built up of something like 3 to 5 stands.   You can substitute the word "platoon" for "unit" for your own thinking as you read the rules, but depending on the nationality and role, it might also be a battery, or a troop, or some other term for a platoon-sized group.  So the rules use the term "unit" instead of "platoon".

 

This is important for your understanding of Mein Panzer -- you are going to push around stands that represent squads of men, or models of individual tanks and trucks and jeeps.  But the stands are not all independently running around doing whatever they want under the hand of divine providence (ie you).  They are organized into units, and you will play them so they operate as units. But you don't have to do a bunch of record keeping -- its just the way the game turn works.  Very simple but innovative concept.

 

Now as to how you base your figures --

You can model the stand however you like.  The rules suggest you put 3 to 5 figures on a stand for a squad.  But this is only representative ... in most WW2 armies the squad was about 10-12 men.  So you could put 10 figures on the stand if you want.  Or not.

 

I have based my force as follows:

4 men = full sized standard squad. Whatever the standard squad was in the army I've modeled, 4 men shows me quickly that this stand is a standard squad. For most cases this works really well. Very quick and easy to see at game time. Now IF it is an army that didn't have an LMG in each standard squad (ie: the Red Army platoon in 1941 had 4 squads, two of which had LMGs and two of which didn't), then I ensure some of my stands have LMGs and some don't. But usually it doesn't matter, as I interpret any 4 man stand as a standard squad.

 

3 men = full sized specialist squad. Might be combat engineers, or artillery crew, or 10-man HQ group. Here I can easily see at game time that this is not just a standard squad, but is some sort of special purpose 8 - 12 man group. Here the specific models will need to be seen for me to figure out what sort of specialist squad it is. But they are reasonably rare, compared with standard squads.

 

2 men = team-sized stand.  Represents a 2-5 man group, not a full-sized squad.  Could be a command element, or an artillery observer team, or a light support weapon team.  It is important in Mein Panzer to distinguish between the ~2-5 man groups (teams) vs. the ~8-12 man groups (squads).

 

Hope that helps.

 

-Mark

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#3 Kenny Noe

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Posted 29 July 2019 - 04:45 PM

Just to echo Mark's excellent reply.  

 

MP is a tank skirmish game.   Once vehicle stand represents once vehicle.  Infantry is typically represented (like Mark said) as Full stands and Half Stands.  The actual minis on a base is not important, so yes you can use your FOW figures in MP!!  <grin>

 

I typically put 4 miniatures on a base to represent a full stand (squad).   Weapon teams (Mortar, Machine Gun, Command, Fire team, etc) represent a half stand.

 

Units are a collection of "stands" in either a historical or fictional TOE.  You can have two to xxx number of units per side.  This helps the "I go, you go" game mechanic.   

 

OOB for scenario Crusade at Sidi Rezegh

 

GERMAN ORDER OF BATTLE
Unit 1 - Company Headquarters VETERAN
Command Panzer III-J (1)
Panzer III-J (2)
Unit 2 - Medium Tank Platoon VETERAN
Command Panzer III-G (1)
Panzer III-G (4)
Unit 3 - Medium Tank Platoon VETERAN
Command Panzer III-G (1)
Panzer III-G (4)
Unit 4 - Medium Tank Platoon VETERAN
Command Panzer III-G (1)
Panzer III-G (4)
Unit 5 - Attached AC Squadron VETERAN
Command Recon SdKfz 223 (1)
Recon SdKfz 222 (3)
 
 
 
ALLIED ORDER OF BATTLE
Unit 1 - Headquarters Unit ELITE
Command Daimler AC (1)
Crusader III (3)
Unit 2 - Tank Troop VETERAN
Command Crusader I (1)
Crusader I (2)
Unit 3 - Tank Troop VETERAN
Command Crusader I (1)
Crusader I (2)
Unit 4 - Tank Troop VETERAN
Command Crusader I (1)
Crusader I (2)
Unit 5 - Tank Troop VETERAN
Command A13 Cruiser (1)
A13 Cruiser (2)
Unit 6 - Anti-Tank Section REGULAR
6 pdr Portee AT Gun (3)

 

 

In this game the Allies have one more "unit" than the Germans.  So there would be 5 "Activations" per Turn.  Unit Activation per Turn would be (initiative dependent)

  1. German one unit --> Allied two units
  2. German one unit --> Allied one unit
  3. German one unit --> Allied one unit
  4. German one unit --> Allied one unit
  5. German one unit --> Allied one unit

Does this help?



#4 acctingman69

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Posted 01 August 2019 - 10:07 PM

Thank you both. Clear as glass.

I'm switching from 15mm to 6mm and so far I like what I see with these rules. I'll be playing solo and I prefer larger games. I get my skirmish fix playing chain of command and it's nice to have something with more units on the table.

#5 Mark 1

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Posted 06 August 2019 - 02:57 PM

I'm switching from 15mm to 6mm and so far I like what I see with these rules.

 

I've been stuck on 6mm since God was in middle school, so I don't have the perspective of changing scales.  But I have wandered through a great range of rulesets over the years, before settling in here on MP.

 

I think these rules provide a very real and sensible balance between "realism" (also known as details) and "playability" (or fast-play).  They also provide a VERY impressive balance between infantry and armor -- really the best I've ever seen.  In most other rules I've played games tend towards tanks tanks tanks, in part because that's the kind of folks who migrate to the smaller scales, and in part because you can find rules that allow players to push 20 or 30 tanks each and still flow reasonably well, but then the moment infantry appear on the board everything comes to a screaching halt and your game turns are suddenly 4 or 6 times longer, and most of your gamers wander off for food or drinks or to watch a movie while they wait for their turn.  

 

Mein Panzer doesn't suffer that. You can field 20 or 30 stands per players (once you are a little familiar with the runs) and the game flows really well, and everyone is engaged and having fun. It works as well with infantry, with guns, with tanks ... it all just flows at a balanced pace.  And you can feel the flow of battle, and perceive the ebb and flow of advantage vs. initiative, or maneuver vs. firepower.  It's fun.

 

If you want to see how I implement my own infantry basing, you might check out the pics I placed in the "On the Workbench" thread here:

 

https://www.odgw.com...orkbench/page-3

 

Look forward to hearing how it works for you, and maybe seeing some pics when you get it all up and working on your gaming table.

 

-Mark

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#6 acctingman69

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Posted 06 August 2019 - 04:32 PM

Thanks Mark

 

I have the rules, but I haven't bought any mini's yet. I want to focus on the North Africa theater (when the US got involved). I don't have anyone to play the game with so I'll be flying solo, but I've found almost any tabletop game can be played solo.

 

I like the scale of MP. It's nestled in nicely between Chain of Command and some of the stand = multiple unit game, neither of which are very appealing to me (although, I've enjoyed CoC with my now defunct group).

 

Thanks for the link. 



#7 Bob Benge

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Posted 07 August 2019 - 10:52 PM

Thank you Mark! :)


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#8 Mark 1

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Posted 14 August 2019 - 02:39 PM

I want to focus on the North Africa theater (when the US got involved).

 

 

See now we share not only a common ruleset, but a common theater of action / focus too!  Torch to Tunisia -- a great choice!  SOOOO much interesting kit to toss around. 

 

 

M3Lee09.jpg

I mean, really, I have ALWAYS been fascinated by the M3 Lee medium tank.  To misquote one soldier's recollection from Atkinson's book: "it looked like a hotel coming down the road at you".

 

FrenchColonialsInfSqd2.jpg

There is so much that can be done.  French Armee d'Afrique forces to confront the US in Morocco or Algeria, then to fight alongside the US in Tunisia.

 

I mean who doesn't want to use equipment that was considered second-rate in 1940 against Panzers in 1943?

 

SaharianasN.jpg

But not just Germans. Lots of opportunity for Italian stuff.  Who doesn't love the Sahariana?

 

M6Fargos1.jpg

And you get to face off with some really oddball, only in Tunisia US stuff, like M6 Fargo tank destroyers.

 

Italian75WatchesBattle.jpg

I've had some very enjoyable and memorable battles set in Tunisia. Absolutely one of my favorite theaters.

 

So I encourage your choice.  And maybe I even whet your appetite a bit as you think about building your forces.

 

(Now let's see how badly Photobucket hashes up my images....)

 

-Mark

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